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Lovers of paedophile and Satanist conspiracies have been having a wonderful time recently with their claims that a Satanist paedophile ring has been operating from Christ Church Church of England Primary School in Hampstead, a beautiful part of North London not far from where I used to live.
Christ Church Hampstead
Such scares blow up from time to time and they always turn out to be nonsense, or at least, if they contain a grain of truth, to be hugely exaggerated. However on this occasion I have paid more than passing attention because the school in question happens to be where two of my children learnt to read and write and where they spent seven exceptionally happy years.
I have had no involvement with the school since 2008, but the Head Teacher and many of the other teachers and staff, as well as the Parish priest, are the same now as they had been then.
When the previous Head Teacher left in 2007 there were some parents, myself included, who thought that her deputy, an inspirational teacher loved by children and staff alike ought to have got the job. The governors disagreed and the post went to an outsider who quickly proved to be a great success, while the former deputy was immediately snapped up to become Head of another Primary School. These things happen and the school continued to prosper under its new Head. It was, justifiably, hugely over-subscribed.
In September last year two children returned from a holiday with their mother, Ella Draper, and her boyfriend, Abraham Christie. She had been separated from their father, Ricky Dearman, for several years. She had alleged that he had been violent towards her, and had taken out a non-molestation injunction against him (such an injunction does not require proof of violence). For his part, Mr Dearman had had endless problems getting contact with the children and the contact dispute had drifted through seven different judges and nine court hearings with no resolution.
Ms Draper and Mr Christie returned from their holiday with video recordings on a mobile phone. In them the children claimed that they had been sexually abused by numerous people, including their father, other parents and virtually all the teachers and staff at Christ Church school.
The children were taken to the police who formally interviewed them (in what are known as “Achieving Best Evidence” or “ABE” interviews). They repeated the allegations which were wide-ranging, exceptionally serious and, to anyone not already steeped in the belief that cults of Death Eaters, Illuminati and Satanists are operating to prey on innocent children, ought to have been regarded as patently ridiculous.
The interviews were summarised by the Pauffley J, the High Court Judge who ruled last week on Barnet Council’s application to take the children into care:
“The children both describe killing and eating babies, drinking blood, being anally penetrated and being injected with drugs. They provide details of all the people who have been involved – all the teachers, parents of children at the school, social services. P says that the killing of babies is done with “cleavers”; the blood from the babies is poured into a “silver bowl” and she and her brother are “sold for £50 each every single day.” When P is asked what sex is, she initially says it’s when they are hit with a big plastic stick between their legs. Then she says “real sex is, like, they get plastic willies, they stick it in our bum, that’s what kind of sex they do.” When asked about the people involved in these activities, P suggests the police should “catch the whole school, catch all the staff there.” She adds a little later that “all the Hampstead schools do it.”
Q tells the police all about the plastic willies, who makes them and how his dad has the biggest because he’s “the boss of every single thing.” Q says that his bottom bleeds and that the last time this happened was on the last day of school when there was a big party. All the children, says Q, “do sex to him;” and at the end of the party his Dad “kills babies and eats the meat.” Like P, Q suggests that “all the teachers, (his) dad’s friends … and also the parents who are really mean” to him are involved.”
Even the school nurse (a delightful motherly woman who was always on hand in my day to apply an elastoplast to grazed knees) was said to be involved in giving sinister injections; and needless to say the Parish priest – a blameless High Church Anglican – was implicated. There were said to be secret rooms in the Church. Babies’ skulls featured in weird rituals. Even nearby businesses were part of the cult. A shoe repair shop in East Finchley apparently used baby skins to make shoes and a nearby MacDonalds was used for murders and body boiling.
Absurd and utterly incredible such allegations appear now, and so they should have appeared to the police at the time. Police were actually given an audio recording of the mother’s boyfriend “coaching” the children at a friend’s house. The friend appears to have been sufficiently concerned for the children’s welfare to have recorded what was happening on his mobile phone.
Unfortunately, in what seems to be the fashionable way, rather than approach the allegations sceptically the police decided to “believe the victims” and treated them, at least to start with, as true. The recording of the children being coached was simply put in a cupboard and, it seems, ignored. The police took the children on a drive around Hampstead so that they could point out venues where abuse had taken place.
More seriously they were also subjected to not one but two separate intimate anogenital examinations by Dr Deborah Hodes.
Dr Hodes is an extremely big shot in the world of child protection. According to the University College Hospital website:
“Deborah Hodes is a Consultant Community Paediatrician in the community trust for the London Borough of Camden and at University College London Hospitals. Deborah studied medicine at the Royal London Hospital and trained in paediatrics …. Deborah is a fellow of the Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health and has an active role there as a co-opted member of the Child Protection Standing Committee and writes for their publications. She represented the College on the Inquiry into Child Sexual Exploitation that reported in 2013 and now is the representative on the Children’s Commissioners Inquiry into child sexual abuse.
“Her key interest is in safeguarding children. She is Designated Doctor in Child Protection in Camden. She teaches both locally and nationally and at UCLH she leads the student teaching of community paediatrics. At UCLH her clinic includes the assessment of children with complex safeguarding presentations including historic sexual abuse.”
Big shot or not, Dr Hodes did not cover herself in glory in this case.
She found, or thought she found, signs of scars or healed fissures around the anuses of both children. On the second examination, a few days later, she found “reflex anal dilatation” in one child. It was supposed findings of RAD, of course, that led to the wrongful diagnosis of child abuse in large numbers of children in Cleveland in the 1980s. It remains a somewhat controversial diagnostic tool. The best that can be said for it is that it may be, but is not necessarily, an indication that sexual abuse has taken place.
A few days after this, both children withdrew their allegations at a further police interview.
A subsequent meeting with other doctors caused Hodes to significantly amend her findings in relation to the “fissures”. Far from being injuries, she conceded that (in the Judge’s words):
“previously confirmed fissures were said to be irregularities in the ruggae (folds, wrinkles or ridges) and their clinical significance was described as “possible normal variant.”
This concession seems to have been overlooked by those who continue to insist that the medical evidence “unequivocally” established that the children had been sexually abused.
Nevertheless, Dr Hodes concluded:
“… the extensive and detailed accounts given by both children, repeated to different professionals, contain details of sexual acts that such young children would need to have had some sort of direct experience (sic).”
Such an observation does not sound like a medical finding so much as a speculative guess; a sort of perverse wishful thinking. The idea that other people could have told the children about sexual acts, thereby allowing the children to repeat them, either didn’t occur to Dr Hodes, or if it did occur she dismissed it as inconceivable.
Even as recently as February 5th Dr Hodes was still treating the children’s allegations (which they themselves had long since admitted were false) as credible:
“the overall situation is such that it is my view that the allegations / accounts need to be taken very seriously despite the confusing picture.”
The children’s withdrawal of the allegations, to use her word, their “recantations” Joan of Arc: recanted her recantation
Joan of Arc: recanted her recantation
(a concept familiar to students of mediaeval heresy trials, when a timely recantation could sometimes save you, as it nearly saved Joan of Arc, from being burnt at the stake) were brushed aside, as though they merely served to confirm the truth of the original allegations:
“Until a study in 2007 it was mostly thought that recantation rates were related to the certainty with which child sexual abuse is substantiated and that retraction of true allegations is rare and that when retraction occurs the allegation is likely to be false. Lindsay et al found a recantation rate of 16.9% in 257 substantiated cases of CSA which had relied on formal interviews by police and social services.” (One could have added another “sic” there; the study to which she referred was actually by a Lindsay C. Malloy, although perhaps that was the judge’s slip).
She recommended:
“a series of more detailed observations and assessments over a longer period of time by a psychiatrist or psychotherapist with a particular interest and expertise in child maltreatment including sexual abuse.”
The Judge described this as “bemusing” because the children had already been subjected to detailed psychiatric examinations.
In fact, as Pauffley’s judgment makes clear, far from demonstrating that they had had any experience of sexual acts, the physical findings were completely inconclusive. The judge ruled that there had been no satanic cult or sexual abuse, and there was a simple though unpleasant reason why the children had claimed that there had been:
“The children’s false stories came about as the result of relentless emotional and psychological pressure as well as significant physical abuse. Torture is the most accurate way to describe what was done by Mr Christie in collaboration with Ms Draper.”
The whole affair is deeply disconcerting on a number of levels.
Lots of people believed, and still believe this farrago of nonsense
The chances that a Satanic paedophile ring of this sort could operate at a Primary School are nil. The idea that large numbers of children could be sodomised with dildos every Wednesday and made to watch babies being murdered, and that their parents would not notice something a little odd going or that they would approve of it is patently ridiculous. The idea that all the parents were themselves in on the Satanism is itself absurd.
At least 5 members of the teaching and administrative staff who were present in my day have been named as Satanic abusers. So I can speak from personal experience. Without exception all of them are gentle, caring people who have devoted themselves to the school and the welfare of the children who have attended it.
Yet according to the mother’s latest video the cult has been in existence “for decades.” Well, it hasn’t. If it had been, my children would have been victims of it, and I would have been a perpetrator. They weren’t and I wasn’t.
One wonders, even in a hugely over-subscribed Church of England Primary School, how were these Satanic parents selected?
Are they chosen from amongst the ranks of the Illuminati, known to each other through participation in secret Satanic Covens?
If so, something went wrong in my case. I am not an Illuminatus, whatever that may be. I have never attended a Satanic coven and would not know what to do in the unlikely eventuality of finding myself at one. Far from enjoying naked sacrificial rituals in candlelit catacombs, I shudder at the prospect of having to shake hands with my neighbour in a Church of England “Sign of the Peace.”
Instead, we filled in a form and explained that we wanted our children to be taught enough about religion to make up their own minds when they were old enough to do so. We had a walk around the school, a chat to the then Head Mistress and we spent a few weeks on a waiting list.
At no time were we asked about our willingness to participate in Satanic orgies, nor was our consent sought to allow the teachers to bugger our children with dildos. If it had been, that would have raised serious questions over whether this was the right school for us.
So it is bunkum.
Yet a relentless internet campaign has been waged, and continues to be waged, to represent a non-existent paedophile ring at an excellent Primary School as merely the tip of an iceberg of similar abuse elsewhere. The unfortunate children (whose videos remain easily available on “truther” websites), who were tortured into making the allegations against the father that they loved, are described as “whistleblowers,” and explicit links are made to similar unproven allegations so as to suggest by a process of attrition that there are paedophile rings in every corner of society.
It is an odd coincidence that one of Ms Draper’s two “McKenzie Friends” (a non lawyer who is permitted to sit in court and assist a litigant in person) is a woman called Belinda McKenzie, who for some years has been one of the leading proponents of the myth that the Downs Syndrome child Hollie Greig was abused by a Scottish establishment paedophile ring. (Anyone who wishes to know more about Hollie Greig would do well to read Anna Raccoon’s superb 2010 dissection of the hysteria). The other is the thoroughly malignant Sabine McNeill, who seems (like the mother) to have left the country in order to continue her campaign without fear of arrest for contempt of court or harassment.
Unfortunately it is not just a few isolated fruitcakes who believe this stuff. That a respected doctor like Dr Hodes could take it seriously, even after the children’s allegations had been both withdrawn and discredited, suggests a dangerous willingness to believe nonsense, amongst even those who ought to to be the most scientifically scrupulous. Likewise, the attitude of the police when the allegations were first made seems to have been to believe the children and to ignore the recordings of their coaching which would have cast huge doubt over the affair.
Real people are damaged
No babies have been murdered, no children have been raped and no virgin blood drunk. But the propagation of the myth of the Hampstead paedophile ring is still immensely cruel to real people. The videos of the children themselves are, in effect, videos of child abuse. The effect of constantly posting and reposting these videos will be to expose the children to ridicule and bullying by their peers, whilst the psychological effects of being constantly reminded of their false stories can only be guessed at.
Nor should the cruelty to adults be overlooked. Practically all the teaching and administrative staff at Christ Church School have been named as members of the Satanic cult, along with many parents. It may be possible to laugh off such nonsense, but when the same allegations are repeated again and again for months it surely cannot be easy to do so. Some people, as the judge noted, have received threatening messages, something that has been facilitated by websites that have listed personal contact details to assist bullies. Online reviews of the school advise people to keep their children away. Church goers are picketed on Sunday mornings. Teachers are urged to strip off to prove that they don’t have devil tattoos on their private parts, as though it is in any way reasonable that anyone should have to humiliate themselves at the behest of crazy troublemakers.
The trouble with these sorts of campaign is that they work.
Almost nobody has the time, even if they had the inclination, to get to the bottom of an internet scare story. To follow the twists and turns of the Hollie Greig hoax, for example, would, by now, require the patience of a saint and the research skills of a Doctor of Philosophy. The same, I fear, will soon be true of the Hampstead Satanic Cult hoax, and no doubt that that is the intention of those who are orchestrating it. Eventually the truth becomes so entangled in thickets of deception and confusion that it disappears altogether to be replaced, at best, by a vague feeling that “something must have gone wrong.” There are already cries of cover-up. Soon, perhaps, there will be calls for an inquiry.
It is impossible to follow the development of the Hampstead Cult story, or the Hollie Greig hoax, without seeing parallels with the allegations of a historical VIP paedophile and murder ring that are being enthusiastically peddled by Exaro News in association with the Sunday People.
Of course it is possible, in fact it is virtually inevitable, that during the 1970s and 1980s Parliament, the armed forces and the intelligence services contained paedophiles. No doubt some of them committed offences against children. It is also, of course, possible that some or all of these organisations contained murderers.
What is in issue here is something quite different: that MPs, Ministers and senior officials participated in organised child abuse and murder, and then colluded in covering it up.
It is impossible to say with complete certainty that there was no such VIP paedophile ring and no murders but there are warning signs that should make us extremely cautious.
First, the central allegation, that children were murdered at orgies attended by Leon Brittan, other politicians and “VIPs” is on its face lurid, bizarre and improbable. The idea that politicians and others would stand by and watch murders taking place; that the bodies could be disposed of and everyone who knew of the crime, including people who were horrified by it, would simply remain silent for 30 or 40 years is inherently unlikely.
Secondly, the story has grown in complexity and confusion as the months have passed. Allegations of cover-ups in high places abound; ex-police officers are said to have been ordered to drop sensitive investigations. Complaints have been made to the IPCC. Talk is of of “D notices” and the Official Secrets Act, dossiers and missing dossiers; links are asserted between Dolphin Square and the Elm Guest House. Hints are dropped that children’s homes in Wales and Jersey are involved. Thanks to Exaro News we even have a detailed account of one of the alleged murders at Dolphin Square (said to have taken place in front of someone known as “Nick”), and of another murder on a Suffolk Estate (said to have taken place in front of someone known as “Darren”), though we know next to nothing of those making the allegations and have no means of judging their veracity. We are invited simply to put our trust in Exaro. The stories are already so many and so varied that some will be tempted to conclude that there must be something in them. The assertion that wicked things have happened and that they have been deliberately covered up has been repeated for so long that it becomes ever harder for anyone to doubt. It is easy to see how in such an atmosphere the fairness of any criminal trial would be horribly compromised.
Thirdly, the police have let it be known that they are treating the allegations of murder as “credible and true” It is hard to know what this actually means. It is one thing to describe an allegation as “credible” (meaning it is “capable of belief”), quite another to say it is “true.”
To announce that a murder allegation is “true” before any real investigation has taken place and even before any body has been found, suggests a dangerous lack of professional scepticism: exactly the sort of mindset, in fact, that was criticised by Pauffley J in the Hampstead case. The police should be investigating “Nick” and “Darren’s” claims, not simply looking for evidence to support them. As a proper scientist looks for evidence to disprove a hypothesis, so a proper police investigation should be actively looking for evidence to undermine their claims. Perhaps this is happening, though the public pronouncements suggest otherwise.
Moreover, announcing that “Darren” and “Nick” are regarded as truthful has the effect of warning anyone who may have a contrary account to give, that the police will regard their accounts as untruthful. Why go to the police with information that might undermine Nick and Darrren if the police have already publicly announced that they will regard your account as “untruthful”?
Should any of these allegations ever come to trial, the declaration by a senior police officer that he thought the claims were true, even before the investigation had properly got under way would invite a comment along these lines from the defence advocate:
“Was this a fair and objective inquiry, members of the jury? Or did the police approach it with the blinkered preconception that Nick and Darren must be believed? Were they blind to the possibility that there was no VIP paedophile ring, no high level cover up and, in fact, no murders?
“And who was really running this investigation, the police or a sensationalist news organisation and its tabloid newspaper partner?”
Fourthly, the Exaro paedophile ring allegations, just like the Hampstead cult allegations, have caused, and will continue to cause, real distress to real people. Bandying around accusations and innuendoes of rape and murder is not something to be undertaken lightly, or because a news organisation is intent on whipping up a story. Yet we have had well-publicised police raids on the recently widowed Lady Brittan, the nonagenarian war hero Lord Bramall and the ex-MP Harvey Proctor. It is in the nature of these stories that even if no charges are ever brought, people will believe that these people are in some way implicated in rape, paedophilia and murder.
These are not trivial concerns.
Anna Racoon – the first to comment – makes a very sound point, with her usual humour.
I do endorse her experience having been lied about, defamed and been the recipients of death threats by some of the most notable cranks around, including more plausible obsessive, liars, idiots and bullies like Matt Quinn, a desperate inadequate seeking attention with no sound grounds or evidence – just the maunderings of his poisoned mind, poor fool and to think he is supposedly involved in the education of young men and women!
Our quoted ‘Barrister Blogger’ will likely be the recipient of the vitriolic and vituperative perverts’ rancour, promoting paedophelia and belief in its every day occurences, particularly amongst the establishment! Without their tin foil hat conspiracy theories where would they be!
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I would really like to see what was in it
HOLLIE GREIG etc. 
{ 78 comments }
Now you’ve gone and done it
A complex issue Anna. Smoke & Mirrors in abundance.
Good grief, I just revisited that original thread. It sure went south after a while, didn’t it?
l’ve come across many conspiracy groups/individuals and found all use the ‘prove we’re wrong’ approach. ln fact it is the very soul of their existance because a conspiracy can never be ‘proved wrong’ . You cannot put forth factual evidence as this is deemed part of the conspiracy itself, the facts have been manipulated or manufactured say the conspiracy brigade.
l’m afraid that you have now become part of the conspiracy yourself in the eyes of the ’27,000′ and others. l hope you are prepared for an onslaught of abuse, for you have put yourself in their crosshairs.
l doubly hope that it never materialises though. l wish you well.
I may have touched upon this story a while back at mines, I cannot remember.
I have been asked to publicise Hollie’s ‘case’ a few times over the past year or so. Tempting as it was to have a pop at the Scottish establishment my spider sense was tingling. I let it be.
I’m glad I did.
Quite honestly, I don’t know enough about this to form an opinion but the link that you give is for the Saskatchewan Association of Community Living, http://www.sacl.org, and not as you state Scotland against Crooked Lawyers. In a case where there is some doubt about facts, please ensure your own are correct.
Thanks Bluebell, I shall check the link – probably my typing!
Bluebell – try this one not that it will do you any good – seems the entire web site has run for the hills…….http://www.sacl.info/
“…seems the entire web site has run for the hills…”
That’s an encouraging sign, isn’t it?
Well done, Anna. More people agree with you than you might think.
Whether or not the allegations have any basis in fact, is irrelevant. There is no proof. And if the abuse was as long standing and as horrific as has been suggested, then one would expect to find something, however small. Instead of which, this child is being abused by the very people who purport to protect her.
WORD PERFECT. Both you and GLW (along with several others) are the absolute voices of reason – do not stop using your voice Anna. Thankyou for speaking for a growing number of people who are genuinely concerned for Hollie Greig’s wellbeing. Poster Girl? She absolutely is, and it’s verging on a criminal act. Please keep going.
Anna,
Good piece, which more than highlights the absolute necessity for evidence before making these kind of accusations.
Sorry to be picky, but you use the word ‘venal’ a couple of times. Perhaps you mean ‘visceral’?
English Viking – thank-you – I meant venomous actually!
Doesn’t matter, still a good piece.
May God forgive you for this coverup.
Well He obviously doesn’t lose any sleep over paedophiles.
Hi,
It is good to see another voice of reason laying out the facts in a professional and forensic manner. Sadly there is absolutely no one providing EVIDENCE in a similarly responsible manner for it seems there is none!
My phone number, my address and my eMail are freely and readily available for ANYONE to provide EVIDENCE of abuse.
In this story to date the ONLY actual EVIDENCE of abuse that has come to light has been the very clear evidence that Hollie Greig, a very very vulnerable member of our society, has been most venally and distatefully publicly exploited and abused by:
Anne Greig her Mother who would seem to be off on a toot of her own but with NO EVIDENCE
Robert Green whose actions have been crass incompetent self serving and criminal, even shamefully naming and blaming his victims as he has NO EVIDENCE
Stuart Usher, who largely due to a distinct verbal communication impediment, has promoted his private grievences and unsubstantiated accusations as with his lurid sacl.info, yet has NO EVIDENCE
Yes there are a number of cunning and sly low lifes on NutJobTV, Bedroom Broadcast Conspirators and low distribution publishing who parade such cases – sandwiched between their sad exploitation of the weak minded and inadequate who have been sat on by life.
Those who wish to blame their own incompetence and failures (and of course their benefit cheques) on lizards, aliens, conDENSATION trails, abductions, Illuminati, FBI, Islam, CIA, immigrants, the bosses, Government, The Masons, Big Government, Common Purpose, Bigger Government, The KGB, Bohemian Grove, Mossad, The Nazis, the New World Order, bullets that bounce off windows, clicks on the phone from auto switching gear, MI5, black ops, The DVD, MI6, Martians, OLAF, secret globalists, The Queen, black helicopters, the Bush family, oil, peak oil, too much oil, lack of oil, UFOs and so on ad naseam.
NO the sad truth is life sat on you and was fairly hard going because you chose your GRANDPARENTS badly and have their genetics.
Sadly the exploitation of Hollie Greig, by the sad and the sick does not want FACTS to expose their conspiracy fantasies, but THEY HAVE NO EVIDENCE.
Fortunately Hollie would seem not to have sufficient mental accumen to understand she is being exploited and abused as she is paraded like an exhibit in a Barnum & Bailey show of freaks of the 1890s. The vicarious pleasure of those who would fail their CRBs must be huge!
nooccaR annA has exposed the exploiters and shown they have got it 100% wrong – first you provide THE EVIDENCE and then you seek Justice.
Approaching it backwards they have made criminals of themselves and shown they have NO EVIDENCE.
IF suddenly Anne Greig or Robert Green produce evidence then sadly it can only be EVIDENCE that they are liars as they have promised me AND OTHERS that we are aware of ALL the EVIDENCE they have.
I believe it is time that the duely funded authorities considered placing far greater supervision and care of Hollie Greig at the top of their priorities, considered medical attention for Anne Greig and prosecution of Robert Green.
It may well be apposite for The Court of Protection to investigate Hollie’s finances and how Anne has disbursed them!
I think that the story has yet further to run, so those deriving a vicarious pleasure from studying the sexual information and claimed abuse may still get their jollies – just as those who derived pleasure from fantasising over Roy Greig’s sad suicide can still get their kicks by issuing their sad death threats as they masturbate in their lonely bedrooms.
IF YOU have any EVIDENCE or need help, I have, as Ms. Raccoon states been exposing abuse since the 1950s!
Regards,
Greg_L-W.
It is time that Mr Green and Ms Greig put up or shut up …
Show the world and your very deluded and duped followers this “damning evidence” that you claim to have to prove that Hollie was systematically and repeatedly sexually abused and violated by a “paedophile rape gang” in Aberdeen throughout the 1990s.
Why did Mr Green not take his opportunity when he had it back in February and March to get the case into the Scottish Courts? What do his very deluded followers know about that missed opportunity? Has he told them he could have exposed Hollie’s case in court but failed to do so?
Are Shropshire Social Services now doing a full vulnerable adult assessment to ascertain if Hollie is fully aware of the allegations made in her name and do they think she should be taken into care for her own protection and to avoid further public humiliation and exploitation on social network sites (Facebook), various blogs and in the alternative media radio and TV world?
Robert Green has done so much damage to many peoples lives and reputations now that he should be further restricted of his liberty and silenced for good … for the sake of Hollie and all those he has publicly named in this abomination of a case. Perhaps it is also time that his own mental state was fully and properly assessed by experts to determine his own sanity and reasoning.
Time the Scottish and English authorities took pragmatic action and end this charade once and for all …
Anna, you deserve great credit for this forensic disclosure of the campaign and its shaky foundations. While my own gut instinct told me that there was something very wrong in the way the story was being promulgated, and therefore probably with the story as well, none of us can say one way or the other if there is any substance to the claims of conspiracy. But what we can be clear about, in large part due to your efforts, is that we should be highly sceptical about the truth-status of the parental version, and the aims of the campaign as well.
Cui bono?
Hi,
Robert Green must be profoundly ashamed of the evil he has stirred up without ANY EVIDENCE.
For those who wish to see the depths of depravity these SCUM will sink to to try to discredit those who have exposed them:
http://stolenkids-hollie.blogspot.com/2010/05/sk-h217-now-look-how-scum-respond-to.html
Robert Green has most clearly stirred up a particularly evil claque of abusers and exploiters seeking their 15 minutes (well 2 possibly) minutes of onanism!
No wonder all the FB groups in their shame are plunging back into the slime under their stones and ‘going private’ like Gollom they do not fair well in the spotlight of truth!
Well done for exposing them M. Raccoon and others now we must try to keep tabs on them so they can not foment more witch hunts for their vicarious pleasure and gain!
So that they can not ruin the lives of more innocent victims and so that where possible they can be kept away from the vulnerable!
Regards,
Greg_L-W.
Talking of Poster girl/boys, take a look at one of the MAIN Hollie Greig propagators; a self-confessed Genius with a microphone and tape machine in his spare room…this is the hard-core DJ (poor man’s Alex Jones god help us). This man apparently came along and offered his gold-plated services to Hollie’s Army **Cor Blimey I hope there are no gays in HOLLE’S army!!** This is the calibre of man they have chosen in a sense over the award winning journo Mark Daly.
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=130400523643760&v=wall
Seriously…. so desperate, misinformed and misguided are this out of control shower, that they jump at any chance of broadcasting this poor wretched woman’s personal details on any old airwave in any old country by the first random disk jockey who sniffs them out and see it as a major breakthrough . Yet still they do not see the utter irony in what they do – that is, parade this vulnerable woman …. actually hang on there. Why not consider for a minute if Hollie’s physical form corresponded with her suggested mental age of say 8. Who would violate a little 8 year old girl ‘s human rights this way and NOT be stopped by the authorities? Come on Social Services, please do something here!
The trouble with groups such as this is that initially one is struck dumb with the horror of the ‘case’ (obviously) – Stage 1. Stage 2 is the feeling of comradeship and strength in numbers and the nirvana of feeling one has a chance to ‘nail the bastard paedos’ which is really quite seductive and satisfying. Stage 3 they are swept up into a thick froth of emotion, campaigning and rampaging …. fundamentally decent enough people (though undoubtedly many with their own agendas) at last with a solid opportunity to make a difference in the world. Fair enough, if the case they are fighting for is a strong one and has oodles of evidence. I think they are stuck now at the level of delirious denial – they poo-poo the likes of Mark Daly and instead choose to worship at the alter of Paul Drockton. They scurry away amongst themselves in hidden Facebook, unable to even consider another perspective like ferrets in a cage planning their big escape into the paradise where Justice for Hollie is a reality. …thanks to them and their leafleting on a Saturday afternoon.
I’m sorry to say that it’s at this point one would consider the possiblity that Hollie has taken a back seat….their own internal ‘told you so’ mantra becomes so utterly paramount, that the subject of and philosophy behind the campaign is shoved under the carpet somewhat. High as kites on their agendas, they are so blinkered that even if the case WAS brought to the highest court in the whole damn world with Ban Ki Moon pouring the tea and Bono and Sting providing the catering …even if here it was ripped to shreds and thrown out of court WHICH IT WOULD BE they would still soldier on regardless! They are gone, swept away with the fairies and merrily the woman’s mother is allowing this to happen. If they all had the strength of character (including the mum and Green) to step down now, there would I am sure be a Mexican Wave of Respect for their courage in doing so from all of us tortured observers of this dire affair.
Hollie Greig will continue as their poster girl and continue to be used by these spectacularly stupid people I’m afraid, until the ‘authorities’ bloody step in and do something about it.
Hi,
to assist >Garibaldi<:
Hollie Greig will continue as their poster girl and continue to be used by these spectacularly stupid people I
Consider the letter of support written and posted.
That was a good analysis of the case Anna. I’ve not got an axe to grind in this case but just want to see it all resolved. You didn’t explore some points that I’m still confused about.
Could you find out why Levy & McRae , the Scottish Justice Sec McAskill ‘s previous employer, are involved and who is paying them ?
Why Peter Watson is allowed to silence any talk of the case in the media ?
Why Lord Advocate Angiolini is allowed to take a role after her previous delays in similar court cases led to cases being thrown outof court. ? And who is paying for all her libel actions ?
Was it necessary to conduct a dawn raid on Mr Greens house ?
Why the court case is taking so long to be heard considering what happened with similar cases in the past that had to be kicked into the long grass.
Thanks
I echo Dave’s request. Its alright Anna and Greg LW shouting from the rooftops but they’re as guilty for not covering the bits that they can’t answer either. No one has a compleatly un clouded, un biased view on this case. Glw has an axe to grind, that is quite apparant from his bitter blogs…and to publish the Greigs address is surely the lowest of the low. And to say that that is what Anne Greig did with the alleged perpetrators…you don’t know that. You are as bad Anna and Greg because you’re feeding off all this too. As for the facts???? They aren’t all up here thats for sure. As for the alleged paedophiles…they don’t need you to champion them….they’re are doing a good job of protecting themselves I would say.
Anna, most brave of you to approach this story again and with such professionalism. Several times I was asked to take it on board, but refused, as I have a personal interest in Down’s Syndrome children and did not want this young woman to undergo any more public display than necessary unless there was evidence.
Two matters in the case stopped me in my tracks. Firstly the mother’s comment that she had to ‘flee’ Aberdeen. I decided she chose to leave Aberdeen after reading her online publications. Secondly when I heard Robert Green implying in his video that the First Minister Alex Salmond was implicated, I looked into the matter. In Green’s video he says Hollie’s mother wrote to Alex Salmond and received no reply (thus Salmond’s silence was his guilty by association). That was untrue. Salmond replied to the mother within four weeks.
Of course agencies such as social services are not perfect, but in defence of Aberdeen, I wouldn’t say they were any worse there than in other areas of the UK. The Scottish legal system does require a shake up and is a small world. In some ways it’s a pity they do not publicly defend themselves against such allegations; in other ways their silence may be more beneficial to the young woman who I consider is being exploited.
There is now so much “information” flying around about this case, and so many reputations being trashed, that surely the time has come for the authorities in Scotland to do something.
Most people I speak to back home in Scotland have heard “bits” of this story, and a lot comment on the involvement of the “elite”, and in particular of a Sheriff..although most cannot name him. All this is rumbling under the surface, and as time marches on will only get worse the way things are going.
Names of alleged victims and offenders are now all over the internet, together with some of their home addresses. Anyone now coming into contact with this case is almost certainly going to believe what they see on the internet. After all, if people have had their names dragged through the mud, including a Sheriff, and nothing has been done to right a possible wrong, then in most peoples minds there must be some truth to the case.
There is not a lot of confidence in the honesty of the justice system in Scotland, and yes, the police there are mostly in the Freemasons, and a lot are corrupt. The Crown Office and Procurator Fiscal Service is also somewhat corrupt. I would hope, that a police force outside of Grampian, preferably not another Scottish force, (too incestuous), be instructed to fully investigate the case in full, and “put it to bed” once and for all. Whoever has broken any law can then get punished accordingly.
It is Fine Running Down Robert Green And Hollie Greig but The young lady is saying she has been raped and she wants to fight,
Mark Daly managed to get a autopsy Report, Remember mark Daly still believes Hollie Was telling the truth about being raped.
and how did Mark Daly get a private Autopsy Report As Ann did not have it when Mark was looking at making his video on the cover up. I hope people do listen to Mark Daly you will hear a very scared Mark Daly May be The sister mentioned was a sister inlaw, is there any kind fellow who can help sheriff buchanan make a video.
I take it if Hollie Greig with Down syndrome can get on a few videos
sheriff buchanan has the right to do the same and the others involved as well, or can take Hollie Greig to court.
There are a lot of people out there trying to burst this particular bubble as it grows and grows beyond the ability of the authorities to control the situation. Good evening trolls! If YOU have any evidence, I mean concrete evidence that you can bring to the police to prove that this horrendous tale is anything less than that portrayed by the Greigs and their supporters – bring it on! Otherwise we are left with the inevitable conclusion that the media, politicians and the legal system are avoiding this like the plague because it will bring their whole pack of satanic cards crashing down – and what a mess that would be. So, yes, support the satanic fraternity if you wish, but I will have nothing to do with it and will continue to support all moves to reveal the gruesome truth about our so-called leaders.
‘If YOU have any evidence, I mean concrete evidence that you can bring to the police to prove that this horrendous tale is anything less than that portrayed by the Greigs and their supporters
What really makes me laugh is the likes of Sandra Barr and Paul Drockton. Never met anyone related to the case and fully prepared to lie and slander on one hand and play the “love and light” card with the other hand……crazy people…
Anna you have made a few errors in your article I am afraid, and you have glossed over certain characters’ input to the cause so let me help you out and give you the chance to dispel the theory that you are working alongside such scum.
The man you write about GLW was actually the first person to put the alleged abusers names on the internet. H’s mother apparently had no internet access and gave this man full permission to blog on Hollie’s behalf as she trusted him. Is honestly possible that a man of such experience (I do not doubt that he is a very intelligent man) would publish this list of 14 names, names of high ranking officials in Scotland without doing his research? Are we to honestly believe that his heart was so big that he jumped on this information with good intentions and printed the names putting his reputation at risk?
Or perhaps… just perhaps… he read over the names, did his research and noticed H’s mother had listed Evelyn as sister and not sister in law. Perhaps he printed this list knowing that if anyone such as Mark Daly became involved that little mistake could be highlighted to make the story less credible?
The said Blogger’s nasty and drawn out arguments with the likes of Paul Drockton have caused Tom George to quit, and unfortunately Mr Drockton took this as a sign of Tom being a ‘turncoat’. Mr Drockton does not speak for all H supporters. I’m afraid his homophobic and paranoid rantings have done the campaign a lot of harm… people are exposing his anti-gay groups with absolute GLEE and calling him poor man’s Alex Jones. So what if he is? It is people like you who are giving him such credence in the campaign. Most of us H supporters really don’t give him a second thought. Why are people like you determined to portray him as ‘a leading light?’
What is your interest in doing so?
Anyway Anna I don’t expect you to print this as you seem to have made up your mind about the whole thing, I just wish I had your black and white approach to life it would sure help me sleep better at night.
Also Pabs and Plum were NOT the creators of the larger facebook group, there was a guy J who set up the group and Pabs contacted him ASKING to be an administrator. Was J perhaps a little too trusting in accepting him? Perhaps he did not realise how big this was going to be….
Anyway Anna best wishes to you, perhaps you won’t mind me pointing out these FACTS.
“Mr Drockton does not speak for all H supporters.” ” Most of us H supporters really don
Garibaldi I honestly do not know what I would do if one of my children said they were ‘raped by lawyers and judges’ and nobody in power would help. I do not know what I would be capable of.
As far as the Drockton issue goes a LOT of H’s supporters have been put off by his unnecessary attack on TG. He is NOT the leader of H’s campaign, never has been and never will be. You only have to look at the amount of members in his facebook groups to see that.
Not the leader no – you mis-quote me. God help you; Robert Green is, is he not? (Much much worse) But Drockton of Mighty Brain IS A LEADING LIGHT!!! The man has a microphone, a radio programme and a loudish voice, is happy to pimp his wretched programme on YOUR FACEBOOK GROUP PAGE dear. **Ding Dong** Penny dropped yet? Hooray, now you see it – Hollie Greig’s face plastered all over the internet, airwaves, leaflets in Glasgow last Saturday etc = total exploitation and I do believe the penny is finally begining to drop. Be brave, go the full way and STOP using Hollie Greig as self-medication all of you. Seek it elsewhere.
Hi,
my congratulations to MotherOf2 – imagine when so much has already been written by way of fantasy by the ill informed and the fantasist exploiting this story amid their chakras, karmas and fanciful bile – I must congratulate you on managing to invent a new Conspiracy.
That’ll keep the idiots guessing.
Just in passing you will note if dilligent I did NOT publish the names first – they had already been put in the public domain. By the way now you remind me that with the simplest of investigation the BBC chap who I have NEVER spoken to but know of well from associates who have worked with him over many years – he of course identified the fact that the list Robert Green had so glibly published without ANY evidence was I gather clearly wrong.
A pity you are not better connected but sadly as you are too ashamed of your foolish comments and your new conspiracy theory to put your name to them or I could have provided you with contacts better informed than I as in this instance I never offered to ‘Investigate’, and both Anne & Robert were more than happy to regularly spend an age on the phone to me and utilise my contacts as neither of them had ANY.
Amusingly we note you are isolated in that you claim Tom George quit because I exposed the imbecilic bedroom broadcaster Drockton for the liar and charlatan he is yet it is he who seeks to conving we are one and the same whilst the idiotic Matt Quinn seeks to claim Paul Phillips, Tom George and myself are actually reincarnations of Roy Greig or Anne’s son – delusional or what, but clearly you are nearly as batty.
You are right though perhaps it was to fltter the flattulent excrecence Drockton by calling him a poor man’s Alex Jones!
By the way is the J of your fantasy your crystal ball assures you set up farcebook – You don’t believe you may have misread the rhunes when in fact you meant Pabs and Plum who were asked by James Ellis to help set it up.
Such a pity of your so called facts you managed to get almost all wrong but never mind with your silly name you are spared the embarrassment that your children may have had with such a staggeringly self important fool as a Mother.
Do try to get the odd thing right next time – IF you want some accurate facts you can give me a call since you are clearly so out of touch!
Regards,
Greg_L-W.
I will back out of this now, clearly I have rattled the cage of a man who is unstable and I just don’t care to be on the receiving end of his next internet RANT. I certainly do not care to telephone a man who is capable of such bile, I feel he has done himself no favours at all being so nasty and vitriolic towards people who are simply seeking the truth and perhaps this is the reason people look to ‘conspiracy theories’ rather than what he DEMANDS we believe.
The lowest point which has been reached so far is printing H’s address on the internet – downright disgusting – so forgive me if I don’t take his word.
Also I did not call Paul Drockton a “Poor man’s Alex Jones’ I was quoting the Raccoon herself.
As for me being a self important fool of a mother well Mr LW it takes one to know one.
Mother of2,
La Raccoon has never referred to Paul Drockton as a ‘poor man’s Alex Jones’ – kindly give a correct reference to this quote.
I do beg your pardon Ms Raccoon this was in another comment by another person. It was not my intention to call him it directly.
Well done Mother of 2 for letting people have an insight into the farce that calls himself GLW. This man speaks of the exploitation and abuse H is suffering by being ”paraded around the internet” , the man is so concerned he contacted Social Services regarding this issue, yet this same man then prints H’s full address on his blog.
Need I say more.
If anything happens to Hollie since her address has been published I will hold you personally responsible.
You will hold motherof2 responsible??
Read your post again Hollie.
The ruthless and reckless charlatan, fantasist, liar and menace that is Robert Green gets called to account in this very courageous and truthful open letter. But will he have the integrity, courage, humility and honour to now do what’s being asked of him … or will his arrogance, selfishness and HUGE ego prevent him for doing so?
Time will tell …
http://stolenkids-hollie.blogspot.com/2010/06/sk-h221-paul-phillips-to-robert-green.html
Well done to the brave, honest, humble and honourable Paul Phillips for calling the very ruthless, reckless and arrogant Mr Green to account.
Paul is a man of honour who deserves to be applauded for exposing this public menace and liar once and for all.
Green should be arrested and put in prison for his reckless actions over the past 18 months.
I have been reporting on this case for some time, and even though I believe that something must have happened to Hollie Greig, I have always refused to name names simply because to do so would ruin any chance of a fair trial should it ever come to court.
The sudden silence concerning the case is suspicious to me, but I shall withhold judgement until such a time as all the facts come to light. Yes, my suspicions are raised…
Meanwhile, if legitimate activists would like me to highlight cases they have successfully prosecuted I would be delighted to do so.
The “Hollie’s Barmy Army” Facebook braying mob …
They all sit at their computers; judging, condemning, speculating, mocking, spitting, hissing, gnarling, growling and ripping each other to shreds.
They accuse, condemn, defame, slander and hang the noose around others necks without a shred of evidence and anyone given a fair trial in a court of law.
They demand “Justice For Hollie” without realising the injustice they are perhaps doing to all those who they have already publicly named and condemned without a shred of evidence to support their screams for “justice”.
They don’t know Anne and that she possibly is indeed mentally ill (to a greater or lesser degree) and perhaps could even be suffering from M
Robert GREEN HAS FINALLY FLIPPED!! …
http://stolenkids-hollie.blogspot.com/2010/06/sh-h224-robert-green-has-finally.html
http://stolenkids-hollie.blogspot.com/
Yep … he finally has!!
Hi,
there is a huge amount more original evidence now published on:
http://StolenKids-Hollie.blogspot.com
ALL bringing us inexorably closer to Justice and the truth and making it clear that only with EVIDENCE can an enquiry be held.
You will however note my cunning plan – I have requested Shrewasbury Social Services learning skills section look into the possibility that Hollie Greig who would seem to have a mental age of around 5 be investigated as there is a possibility she is being exploited and abused!
Clever or what!
Obviously this will lead to establishing the truth and getting Justice – IF the braying asses of Hollie’s Bonkers Army of nutters are right and Robert Green & Anne Greig are telling the truth then we WILL get Justice and they have nothing to fear.
IF of course they actually have something to fear they are likely to be councelled by those seeking to exploit them to ‘leg it’ – of course this will be most effective until Hollie has need of medical care WHAT THEN?
How confident are those who would be mad enough to harbour them that long term damage isn’t being done – have YOU the expertise to stop Robert, or worse still Anne going Postal IF they are exposed by the very enquiry they wanted me to get for them!
There is as you ALL know for certain NO EVIDENCE could there be some out there who are stupid enough to take these risks with other people’s lives WITHOUT EVIDENCE.
You have seen the utter lunacies of poor sad/evil Robert Greens Uriah Heep performances and his utterly and proven barking denunciations of ANYONE who has seen through his scam. If you haven’t – hunt them down they are a text book study of delusional derangement – the man is as mad as a stoat – a dangerous out of control menace in society at large.
Just read the FACTS produce the evidence. His stunning stupidity is there for all to see. As with the MADLY proliferating blogs and web sites crammed with bizarre fantasies and obsessions about me and sadly also A.R.
I could care less I owe my living to no man and in my impecunity I have the independence Millionaires strive for – but think of the lynch mob should they ever wish to get off of benefits and get a job and a life – will their current fantastical stupidity harm their prospects for life as they linger on on the internet?
Sorry – false sympathy is so transparent ;-(
Regards,
Greg_L-W.
“How confident are those who would be mad enough to harbour them that long term damage isn
can anyone clarify how the justice system works?
I had thought that if there are complaints of abuse against a vulnerable person, then the justice system in the process of preparing a case for court, would require social services to provide reports? How would Social Services do this if they did not interact with the complainant?
Surely the FB campaigners and Robert Green who want an open investigation should see this as a step to what they have been asking for?
#45, I am reading your links in utter horror. Robert Greens ‘statement’ is nuts. If social services don’t get involved and protect this woman from him and the FB crazies there is going to be a tragedy. I can’t see any other outcome unless this madness is halted now.
Hi,
Radical – I regret you are 100% right and thse exploiters are now USING Hollie, Anne & Robert and it is a VERY dangerous and unpredictable game they are ‘playing’ they know it but insist on basing their idiotic arguments on barely understood hearsay, inadequate checks and trying to make as if who cares what money I have.
The barking bufoons at UKIP column are now openly claiming it must be true I’m a Government agent because they don’t know where I get my money from!!
Just think this loon Gerrish was once allowed to wear a British Uniform and put in charge of a plastic washing up bowl and a crew of not many! But people no less!
One of UKIP’s very few sensible actions was toss him out alomng with the idiotic and vicious Albert the polisher and legal genius (well Special Constable!). You just couldn’t make it up. Gerrish has surrounded himself like a latter day Charlie Manson in his cult of geriatric crones and bizarre Squeeky Fromes!
They’ve got god which is deeply worrying he is supposed to have wandered around on a hill near THEM.
Gerrish had a hissy fit with me years ago when I gave him his first platform outside his bathroom! An intense, paranoid and furtive little chap but I made the mistake of questioning his evidence – I supplied him with data on the graduates of Common Purpose and as ever he had to be in charge and stole the disc!!
He is not a lot less mad than Robert Green but just as vicious if you ask for EVIDENCE. That is why they make absolutely no meaningful headway because all that a cult permits is sad followers but no reason, no logic and heaven forefend NO EVIDENCE!!
Watch their seminars on video they are slick, competent and crass!
Now look at the fantasy of the Hollie Story!! NO EVIDENCE just the utterly mad ravings of Robert Green – all so simple to repudiate.
By the way why is it their business how I ear my money? I’m puzzled by that! So because the idiots can’t identify how I live I must be a Government agent – how barking is that!!
These idiots must be the only people left who have avoided reading my output – anyone heard the latest joke?
Greg’s a Government Agent!!
OK Green, Gerrish, and the rest of the paranoid lunatic fringe – have you got any evidence to back your fantasies, libels, slanders and defamation.
Regards,
Greg_L-W.
I am shocked at the way this has panned out. Shocked with myself. Shocked by the brimstone evangelists that send you to hell for questioning your own faith in THEIR conviction. Shocked by the way they stand for justice whilst parading a vulnerable girl like a wild west freak show in the name of openess and justice. Shocked by the hypocritical demands for answers and apologies (yet can come forward with neither). Shocked at the remorseless cold treatment of people who have given so much time, effort, energy, dogmatic trust – that are then hailed as shills and agents merely for asking to have the conclusive proof shared or acted upon before we continue with upholding the most serious of claims possible. Shocked at the fact that the government have not stepped in to defend themselves (probably because they do actually have something to hide – nothing to hide, nothing to fear remember). Shocked at the vitriolic abuse that is spat at each other in the name of truth. I am shocked at the human race. We are an abomination to evolution. I am also not only shocked but disgusted with all of the above.
I have however met many quiet, genuine, hurt, hopeful, needy and clearly wonderful people that have fallen foul of our own species, especially through being involved in this. Be it those that genuinely want us to do a lot better as a species or victims of establishment, relatives, social networking lunatics, glory hunters, paranoid deviants. These are the people I stand for. The hope for humanity is with them and it is these that will suffer most from the continuation of farces such as this that is Robert Greens responsibility to address honourably.
There is oil flooding into the seas which is a potential disaster of a scale we have never known, there are soldiers killing innocent civilians in illegal wars with radioactive munitions, heads of banking and media colluding in secret meetings – that is NOW.
We are consumed with the actions of a charlatan. But it is all part of the change that we are seeing and it is down to the individual to seek and accept the truth. I accept my foolishness in running with this over the last 5 months and am seeking to rectify it, not to save my skin, but as I am duty bound to make all those aware of my concerns for the validity of something I so strongly disseminated to them. How do I explain to my father that what he got so upset by but was proud of my courage to stand for – that it was a hoax? My friends. 27000 people that came in hope? There have been some incredible lessons here. If we learn from them I believe we can forgive ourselves and others and also still see the change we hoped for.
My thoughts are, as they always were, with Hollie for whatever the truth of this – it is she that will remain the abused and innocent. Also with those that looked to this wreckers lamp charading as a lighthouse in the storm of our de-humanisation.
Consequence is no coincidence.
Pablo,
I stand in awe of your eloquence.
Congratulations.
here, here.
Aye well that’s set me off with the tears Pabs. Beautiful, the utter truth perfectly written and presented in a nut shell. Thankyou.
Agree with all the above plaudits.
Pabs – you know how I feel about you buddy … the most honourable and decent man to come out of this tragedy.
I am as regretful about this whole very sorry and tragic state of affairs as you are and am very ashamed that I was duped by the charm, plausibility and cunning ruthlessness and recklessness of Robert Green – he who demands apologies of others, but isn’t honourable and honest enough to do so himself and concede he might, just might, have made a mistake and got it wrong … a hellova lot wrong. The arrogance of this man is quite astounding.
God help Anne and Hollie now – wherever they may be hiding out? They are in the “care” of a charlatan(s), deluded fool(s) and criminal(s).
I only hope if they are in need of urgent medical help, their own health won’t be sacrificed to protect the identity of those who have spirited them away.
My thoughts are with them – no matter what they too may think about me now … I care not a jot what the braying mob think and they are free to phone me if they want to denegrate me and challenge me in any way.
07791-226-490
I am not a “brimstone evangelist”. I am though quite confused as to your position.
“How do I explain to my father that what he got so upset by but was proud of my courage to stand for
Scarlet Pimpernel said …
“May I ask just what it is you think the government have to hide if it is all a hoax?” …
Perhaps the fact that they should have dealt with the allegations more thoroughly and professionally a decade ago, thus avoiding the ill-informed, ruthless, reckless and highly irresponsible braying mob onslaught ten years later.
Still waiting for Drockton and Green to publicly apologise and show some humility …
“They seek them here, they seek them there … those many duped souls seek them everywhere. Are they in heaven or are they in HELL, those damn elusive Pimpernels”!
Fair point Mr George. However, I hope you do not think I am “ill-informed. ruthless and highly irresponsible”? Perhaps a couple of hundred years ago, but not now. As for braying, I leave that to the more unsavoury of mobs sir!
Does our Mr George also speak for you Mr Phillips?
You are thoroughly deserving of an apology from the American, but Green? Has he also slandered your good name?
Finally sir, if I am in “HELL”, then I can only say what a thoroughly pleasant “HELL” it is! In fact, I could not recommend “HELL” more highly!
I have no idea if you are “ill-informed, ruthless and highly irresponsible”. I am still seeking you as you know. But I’m delighted to read you are not of the braying variety – that’s a relief to see … phewee! I would never wish to cross swords with you SP.
No, of course, I don’t talk for Pabs – he, like G L-W, is more than capable of speaking for himself, as I think you know. But I do respect him immensely and agree with his very eloquent analysis of this very tragic tale now I regret to say.
Thank you for agreeing that “the American” does indeed owe me apology – I can clearly see, whoever (and wherever ?) you are, you are a fair, reasoned and rational person. It is a great pity there weren’t more amidst all the melee that ensued some time ago in this very sorry affair.
Yes, I’m afraid the ever so charming, plausible, manipulative, arrogant, cunning, ruthless, reckless, two-faced and LYING Mr Green (SUE ME) has indeed slandered my name with others – as he has Pabs … to me on the phone on Tuesday past when I phoned him up again to challenge his deafening silence and callous indifference and to put him on the spot. He said Pabs was “a liar” in fact – just like I apparently called Hollie “a liar” … NOT. It was pretty desperate stuff. Now that I am no longer just another “yes man” and adoring, deluded, duped and fawning fan, he has gone off me somewhat – kind of indicates the very warped and ruthless personailty-disordered type we are really dealing with here. Not very honourable or gentlemanly at all I’m afraid to say.
I am of course so sorry to learn that you are presently in “HELL”, but I am pleased to read that you seem to be in good company there. I hope you never get burnt and enjoy the stay with “the more unsavoury of mobs” you encounter whilst down there.
Good day to you SP. I certainly won’t ever cross swords with you again!
Open Letter to Mr Paul Drockton – he who doesn’t have the honesty, integrity, honour and humility to publicly and unreservedly apologise to me, Pabs and many others for his own “slanderous filth” …
Mr Paul Drockton
“Dead Mans Musings”
The Paul Drockton Online Radio Show
USA
Email: pdrockton@aol.com
Friday 4 June 2010
Paul
My honest and truthful reply … and in fairness to all concerned
You left me without a name on your online radio shows last Friday night (28 May), Monday night (31 May) and Tuesday night (1 June) when Robert was on – no unreserved apology on the latter programme from you or Robert … how honourable and gentlemanly you both are! You accused me of being things I am plainly not and that I said “Hollie is a liar” – I have / would not say that … EVER. You slandered my name and wished me harm and ill. “Slanderous filth” indeed sir!
This whole thing turned pear-shaped after the Mark Daly interview on the Tony “Legend” radio show on the night of Sunday 25 April 2010 – where Robert and Anne were found wanting and doubts starting to develop amongst those who believed every aspect of this “case”. You know how this developed over the course of that week, no thanks to your bullish and egotistical behaviour – when you and Greg started to name call, flame and let your big egos take over … and I was caught in the crossfire in the process. Greg at least has had the decency and integrity to apologise and express sincere regret over that and I accepted his apology and know he never intended for me to become “collateral damage”.
I have made my position perfectly clear about Greg in my previous emails to you several times. I agree he has perhaps overstepped the mark about certain things and I certainly do not agree with all he writes – I do not want you or anyone to commit suicide or come to any harm or ill … he should not have said that, but we all can say things in anger that we don’t really mean and later regret … I have done so many times throughout my life and I am obviously very regretful for doing so … but we all sadly do. I am not Greg’s master and cannot force him to stop what he says on his blog. He has been getting a lot of “slanderous filth” too and even death threats as well – perhaps you might want to retaliate and would get very angry too … I know I certainly would not take such “slanderous filth” without wanting to defend my good name … as I have been doing over the past few days with you Again, I am not defending Greg (he is perfectly capable of doing that himself) and I don’t agree with everything he writes, but I would say there are certainly reasonable mitigating circumstances for his actions over the past 5 weeks.
Greg is not working for the government (nor am I or Pabs – which is just very paranoid thinking if anyone thinks we are), he is not the devil, he is not evil and he is not mad or deranged – had you spoken to him at the end of April when suggested, you could have determined that for yourself. But he is obviously very hacked off that he has been rounded on by a largely ignorant, ill-informed and angry braying mob who do not really know him or the full circumstances of his involvement in Hollie’s case since early last year – and you did exactly the same when you wrongly accused him on my now defunct “Scots AgainstInjustice” Facebook Profile Wall on Tuesday 27 April 2010 and then left him without a name on your online radio show on Thursday 29 April 2010 – which I challenged you over on a point of principle (his right to reply to your charges) and you refused to respond and phone me as I requested.
There are a lot of people now who are greatly dissatisfied with the apparent lack of HARD evidence. There are a lot of people who feel used, abused, duped and discarded. There are a lot of people who doubt the veracity of the whole case. There are a few people who have been involved since last year (I was one of that few) who have now been hung out to dry without a public apology from Robert, Stuart or Anne – or with even a hint of any regret in a public statement.
And you wonder why there is now all this mud-slinging, anger, nastiness, hatred, bile and “slanderous filth”!?
Speaking of which … I still await your full, proper, public and unreserved apology from you for your “slanderous filth” towards me – and Pabs.
How about it Paul? …
Show some honesty, integrity, honour and humility as I have done and just say …
“I’m profusely sorry Tom and I unreservedly apologise … I slandered your good name without justified reason and I was very wrong to do so” …
And put it on your website for the public record as well.
I’m waiting Paul …
Tom
07791-226-490
cc. Stuart Usher, Robert Green et al
PS. Remember Paul … it was because of you that I am now in the position I am and getting accused of things that are simply untrue, unfair and unjustified.
This letter can be freely disseminated to others and reproduced anywhere on the internet – but the full and complete text only.
__________
ADDENDUM:
Anna Raccoon is as much a shill as I am. Those who still think myself, Pabs, Greg and Anna are “highly paid government agents” really ought to seek immediate psychiatric help for their paranoid disorders.
Anna Raccoon is as much a shill as I am. Those who still think myself, Pabs, Greg and Anna are
Hi,
after the eloquence of Paul Phillips so well presenting the case – just look at this shamefull and cowardly drivel from some no nothing low life with little command of the language and less knowledge of the facts.
Little wonder that this particular cowardly excrecence is too ashamed to put his name to the nonsense he circulates.
I am sickened by the sponge brained snivelling cowards like this buffoon – pre pubescent little girls trolling the internet making much of showing off – Robert green is not disimilar with the hatefull residual gaggle of wituperative witches egging him on in his obscene and irresponsible behaviour – Cat Shit or whatever you childish name is you are clearly out of your depth, just leaping up and down showing off.
Be grown up enough if you are going to dishonestly and vituperatively defame adults to put your name to your banal mutterings.
Now sunshine for all your sad weenie waggling pop your plastic mac back on and let us know:
Where is the evidence – have YOU Personally seen ANY EVIDENCE.
Remember those ‘Show and Tell’ lessons you were having not so long ago – well you sad muppet SHOW & TELL what evidence YOU have seen.
In best part of 2 years involvement with this sad fantasy I have seen not one shred! Now we have some irresponsible foul mouthed (yes I saw your childish posting an the batty Sandra Barr’s secret squirrel site & the shamefull comments of that geriatric creep Stuart Usher who surely is old enough to know better! & yet again Brian Gerrish’s childish dribblings in his fantasy comic for the lunatic fringe obsessed with how I earn a living which PROVES for these half wits that I am a Government agent, a measure of their sanity!)
ButlinCat – you are a risible fool with little intelligence and less common sense another motor mouth unfettered by thought or reason and blind to the FACTS – you are defaming people with not a shred of evidence and in the association of the criminal nutters.
I now believe that for Hollie & Anne’s safety it is time they were taken into care in a swecure unit until this madness calms down.
There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that they are BOTH at risk – and of course Hollie as a desparately impaired person with a mental age around 5 is most ably suited to continue in the loving care of her Mother but obviously with suitable medical and Social Services support to avoid exploitation and abuse in the future from evil people like Green, butlincat, Barr, Usher, Drockton, Gerrish and others willing to rush in without ascertaining a single solitary FACT.
There is NO EVIDENCE, there was NO CRIME until Robert Green & Stuart Usher started to commit one.
IF ANYONE has one shred of doubt of the FACTS in this fantasy surrounding Hollie Greig please feel free to contact me – you don’t have to believe me or trust me but do listen before there is a tragedy!
butlincat2012
MESSAGE TO MEDIA 4 6 10
Thu Jun 3, 2010 17:05
92.16.244.25
Hi – I just wish to inform you that the people mentioned in the press release below are nothing to do with our cause of trying to get justice for Hollie Greig,on facebook and numerous other sites.We are trying to get justice in this case of sexual abuse against her by a Scottish paedophile ring, the ring consisting of a top policeman {now deceased}, nurses, social workers, lawyers, and many more, the whole atrocity being covered up from media exposure by the Law Advocate of Scotland Elish Angilioni, probably by subtle threat and inuendo of dire consequences should the facts of the case be reported in the main media. Please be clear these crimes did exist, for at least over 15 years to Hollie, and are probably still going on today to some poor innocent child.Hollie was awarded
The one person who matters most out of all the rest is Hollie herself. If Hollie was abuse by her father at first, i am surprise he was not arrested as the primary suspect.
There are procedures that come into play, when an allegation of abuse is reported. The Police, social workers, who are trained in child protection, would have concern, not only for Hollie but also, equally for other vulnerable people, who may have been abused.
The seriousness of this abuse is because Hollie, is not only a vulnerable adult, but also more so because she lacks capacity. That means she is open to be coerced into doing things, by those who are out to exploit her
The person or persons who committed the abuse would be the only ones who hold the evidence. That is why an investigation, involving many professionals is triggered.
A Professional who works in child Protection has told me, that Hollies
Some good points John.
We should also remember there were some very abnormal aspects to the treatment received by Robert Green following his first arrest. As you will recall, his hearing took place in Stonehaven despite the Aberdeen Press & Journal (red herring or misapprehension?) saying it would be (as would have been expected) in Aberdeen Sheriff Court. Then there is the fact that the the hearing was held in camera! Quite extraordinary for a trifling Breach of the Peace, wouldn’t you say?!
I was present for those events. One of the people I spoke with that day was the duty solicitor in Aberdeen Sheriff Court. She assured me that asking concerned callers (wanting to know where Robert Green was!) to leave their names and contact details with the Procurator Fiscal’s (PF) call centre (in Glasgow) was completely unheard of! Incidentally, the PF call centre people refused to tell anyone where or even if, Robert’s case was being held that day. If Robert Green is to be believed, the police (or others?) told him on the Friday(!) that his hearing would be in Stonehaven. (Shame they didn’t inform the P&J…?) Why then could the PF’s office not tell us that on the Monday? Should information like that not be in the public domain? Obviously I was also very concerned about Robert’s no-show at court, however, not one official in the court could (or would?) tell me anything. (I found out via the Internet like everyone else.)
Incidentally, while loitering in the hallways of the court, I more than once heard chatty banter between advocates and others to the effect of, ‘It’s awfully quiet for a Monday’.
Finally, also worthy of note was the heavy police presence in and around the court in Stonehaven. (We counted around 7 or 8 officers.) I was informed by two reliable locals that again, apart -perhaps- from hearings involving powerful drug lords and the like, this was utterly unheard of.
I believe that whenever the authorities seemingly deviate from Standard Operating Procedure in manners such as these, freedom-loving citizens should endeavour to find out why. And you know, as they say, no smoke without fire!
Luv
Shone
PS GLW is forbidden from re-producing in any manner this, or any other of my writings. I don’t mind others doing so, just as long as I am not misrepresented.
PPS The PF call centre staff *only* asked for people’s names and details after they knew who we were calling about. To quote the lady I spoke with, “Ah right, we’ve been told to take your name and contact number…”
Hi,
I note with some amusement the astonishing lack of understanding of the law on the part of Shona – she cleeves to herself the near divine right to defame, dissemble and distort and seeks to deny the right of the truth.
IDIOT – why not type at the top:
Here are my lies and no one is allowed to tell the truth.
Shona you have no such legal right though it is clear you fear the possibility nay probability, well in reality certainty that you will be proved wrong on many of your ridicul;ous misrepresentations and fanciful leaps of logic.
I will return to your self indulgent twaddle and answer it in full on StolenKids when it suits me and to suppress the truth you may by all means lose a fortune in the law courts trying to uphold a right to lie without right of reply!
This sadly is anexample of the rigor that has been brought in this story and it is founded quite clearly on mob rule, the lynch mob and hysteria, from idiotic people like Shona who eggs on sad figures like the liar and fool Stuart Usher.
Your special pleading to lie without retort is just risible!
Regards,
Greg_L-W.
Sir,
At no point in my “self indulgent twaddle” did I lie and I resent your slanderous assertions that I did!
Just to make things abundantly clear for you; the parenthesised comments ending in question marks represent CONJECTURE, which I fully accept may not be representable of the truth. (The clamp down on free speech has not gone that far, has it?)
Conjecture aside, I would be more than willing to repeat *any* of the above in a court of law.
Once again, I forbid you from re-producing my “self indulgent twaddle” on any of your sites.
Shona
PS To be more legally rigorous for you, replace CONJECTURE with OPINION. Those opinions being based on facts.
Hi,
I’m surprised John Banks hasn’t found out ANY of the relevant details and I guess his chum in Social Services must be very lowly to dispense such opinions with no facts!
You seem unaware that you found your views on two assumptions – first that your chum has a clue about Scottish procedures and secondly that an abuse took place.
Next since these points are unknown to you, you state with certainty that the handling procedure was at fault – Oh!
Need I continue as clearly you too have seen NO EVIDENCE.
Regards,
Greg_L-W.
As I have said, the primary concern is for Hollie, since she was abused. If the abuser of Hollie was an ordinary
Hi,
John with respect I suggest you take the advice you have offered in your last paragraph.
You clearly know nothing of this story.
Be minded there is not one shred of usable evidence that words are put in the mouth of a woman with a mental age of 5 is all too possible.
It is claimed that Hollie Greig was serially and gang raped BY ADULTS, over a period from 6 to 20 yet concealed this from her Mother deliberately and dishonestly – she has manifest no medical evidence of rape, no forensic evidence of rape, no physical evidence of rape and no reaction to gang rape.
There is absolutely no evidence of rape and what Mother would be so uncaring as to have no cogniscence of distress nor signs of laundry. This was a child who, it is claimed, without evidence, had been both vaginally and anally raped WITHOUT ANY EVIDENCE!!
We also have a fantasy of the murder of Anne’s brother – again with not a shred of evidence that his death was other than suicide and further more with apparent due cause.
PLEASE take your own advice.
Regards,
Greg_L-W.
Greg you used the word rape,in relation to a child,7 times in that rather brief post.
time for a cold shower me thinks.
just for the record,are you the same greg hyphen hyphen that accusses gordon brown of having a taste for rent boys?
the same greg hyphen hyphen who says he has proof that tony blair was tried and convicted for gay sex in a public place
your posts reveal a very strange mind at work,one which you have my sympathy for having to inhabit
dont bother getting yourself all worked up into some self-righteous indignant self important rant because I wont be returning to this awful blog,I feel dirty enough after a single visit.
I would have thought Hollie
Call me naive John but when I first read about this story, my initial reaction was like everyone else’s…it was like one of these crap novels you find in a charity shop bin. Horrifying story and you just couldn’t help but be sucked in by it. But the logic part of my tiny brain nagged me into ditching the emotion …. and I found things much clearer.
I have a very old friend who worked in a woman’s refuge for 16 yrs – the few stories she shared with me over that time would make your flesh creep and eyes water and even she said of this case – no, it would not stand up without concrete evidence. They do not have it she said. What about the girl’s father…thats where any hope of a conviction lies. And she knows, believe me. John, you do not stand a chance in hell of success. Face it, and if you must keep your campaign going then for god’s sake make some major changes quickly before Hollie’s life becomes even more difficult for her. And it will, believe me. None of us baddies are spys or crooks. We are all good people who want what is best for this woman and are fighting to get it, like you. But I do believe we have logic on our side; your team are too damn high on emotion and have seriously cocked things up. Bring them to heel!
Hi,
John do you have evidence to back this contention?
Perhaps the facts gathered relentlessly over well over a year would have helped you.
When did he leave? Why? etc.?
You may tend to be a little more accurate if you had established the facts!
Regards,
Greg_L-W.
Any allegation of sexual abuse, in the first instance, the named perpetrator would be arrested, and charged. Hollie
/|\
Woops!
Hi,
a very valid THEORY
I have been following this alleged abuse story for some time. Originally, I did ask for various pieces of evidence, and none were in fact forthcoming – I believe most of the ‘evidence’ is in fact hearsay or circumstancial, which does not constitute proof at all.
I more or less dismissed the whole thing as yet another conspiracy theory, of the type that abounds all over the internet, from ‘inside jobs’ on 9/11 and 7/7 to lizards in charge of the government.
However, one ot two recent events have intrigued me, over and above the alleged abuse.
Firstly, the ‘raid’ on Anne Greig’s Shropshire home and the changed locks on the doors – why did this occur ?
Secondly, why isn’t Green being sued for libel ? People have been in the courts for much less than is inferred by his allegations.
Thirdly, there is this Lance Watkins character. I don’t know anything about him – I have no axe to grind. But he is certainly weird – the way he constructs sentences is very very odd – he reminds me of a public schoolboy from the debating society who suffers from arrested development.
However, personality apart, this Lance Watkins has placed some photographs on his blog, which according to Green , can only have been obtained during the ‘raid’ on Anne Greig’s house. Try as I might, I cannot find where Lance Watkins has stated where he sourced these photographs , or a denial that he got them from the ‘raid’ on Anne Greig’s house.
Whether Hollie Greig was abused, whether Anne Greig is mentally ill, or Green is a looney, I do not know. But I am very intrigued, and somewhat concerned , about the way that the ‘authorities’ are dealing with this matter.
In particular, since Lance Watkins is ‘holier than thou’ , I would like clarification WHERE he got the photographs of Roy Greig from – just to restore my faith in no-conspiracy-at-all.
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